1. He who is without sin, cast the first stone comes to mind. Forgiveness is ultimately God’s job. Sin that impacts the public and is so visible makes us think we all get a vote. A lack of forgiveness is really not an option if we are to be like Christ.

2. At times I would love to be able to see someone’s heart, to know for sure if their repentance is sincere. If the restoration is real. Of course, that might mean others could see my heart as well. Not as comfortable a thought. God alone knows if Ted is doing this out of obedience or other wrong motives. We can only pray that if it is from God it will be blessed and that others will see an example of God’s grace. And if it is not from God .. that it would fail and none would be led astray.

Is it hypocritical for us not to forgive a fellow sinner?

Forgiveness for followers of Jesus is not a choice. It is a requirement. For this specific issue there is nothing for me to forgive as I do not know Mr. Haggard. He didn’t hurt me. He hurt the church at large but people around the world do that everyday.

If Mr. Haggard came to me personally and asked my forgiveness I would give it to him. But if I asked me to start attending his church, well, that’s another answer all together.

Does forgiveness and restoration mean any Christian leadership role is okay?

This question is a lot harder to answer. I don’t think there is an answer that covers every situation. It will depend on so many factors. The Bible gives us many examples of fallen leaders who are restored to leadership. Who is the authority to restore the mantel of leadership? God? The followers of the leader? Just because a woman or man says they are a leader doesn’t really make them one. In the Christian context it is God – Breathed. So the answer to your question is…it depends on the situation. Employ wisdom and discernment.

Lots of good points have been made here. I will just add that I do believe that forgiveness and restoration and reconciliation are all inter-related issues but they are not all the same. We can forgive someone but depending on circumstances may not always be reconciled. They also may not choose to repent, which is a key element of restoration.

Do I think he should start a church and pastor again? I have no idea. It makes me uncomfortable but I do have friends who have had moral failures, repented, returned to ministry and are touching many lives. An obvious Biblical example is David. I agree with Jere. It depends on the situation, the person. And in the end our opinion counts for little. (and in this case, nothing at all.)

While I hope I can show grace, I am almost positive I would struggle with attending his church. Does that mean I want my leaders to be perfect? No, I don’t expect that. But I’m afraid I would have a hard time trusting. And if you can’t trust your pastor, it is difficult to sit under their teaching and leadership. I do believe that forgiveness and restored trust are two different issues.

Very interesting and very relevant topic. I’ve thought about it a lot, too. And then realized that “thinking about it” was exactly the problem. It’s not my thing to think about. This is between God and Ted. I know God’s already forgiven him in the same way He’s already forgiven me. Sin is sin, period. And, we all deal with it.

As far as leadership goes? To assume a call can no longer exist because of sin would mean that every pastor should step down. A call is a call, period. God will use everything for His good, including ministering to people only Ted can minister, too. All we need to do is trust God.

Thoughtful post…and I love the comments!

The Donatist controversy settled this question sort of. It said that those priests who sold out to the empire and denied Christ made their enacting of the sacraments null and void.

It was decided that the sacraments in and of themselves were valid in spite of the condition of the priest performing the action.

That being said, I think welcoming back into ministry without a process of peer review by those who can compassionately judge the repentance of the person is an “unwise” thing to do.

Two cases come to mind Jimmy Swaggart and Don Moomaw. One completed a time of review and the like and was restored by those who are part of their tribe. The other short circuited the process and declared he didn’t need his peers review.

In Ted’s case I will err on grace and assume he’s moved through such a process and pray for a revival to flow from God’s work.

Peace
Alan

great post.

1. forgiveness doesn’t mean forgetting. it DOES mean we don’t hold that against him… and DO believe God called us to forgive just as He forgave us. so yes. it’s hypocritical… but more importantly, it’s binding for the one who won’t forgive.

2. yes and no. God speaks through our stories… however… i’m not sure starting a church (as the lead pastor) is a good or smart thing for him to do so soon after all that’s happened. i don’t see anything wrong with him being a part of a team or a supporting role of some kind. after all… we are all pastors if we are doing what God has called us to do.

in the end, it’s not up to us what he does… but am i praying for him, his wife, his family and his church. YES!

1. I thought forgiveness was one of those non-negotiables in our faith.

2. I think I’d have to ask the Apostle Paul if there was a sin that could be committed before being a Pastor or a teach or someone in the ministry. He killed Christians. Then went on to be one of the greatest influencers (to use a hip term) in our faith.

I think this all confined to our limited perspective on sin. One sin worse than another, etc. I mean, we’re both sinners and yet God allows us to actively participate in church leadership, and maybe this is a very shallow view of the situation and a very simple way for me to state it, but, if we bar someone from ministry due to past sins, shouldn’t we all be barred from it?

Anyway, great questions Tyler. I love seeing updates in my RSS Reader!!

Couple quick thoughts.

Paul’s sins against the church were before he came to know Christ which does make a difference.

The Bible does speak to sexual sin being “worse” in some ways.

In the end though, where sin abounds, grace abounds all the more.

I can agree to that and I really like your last statement. If we keep him from ministry, is there then a list of sins we can or cannot commit to still work in ministry? And that’s where my mind is wrestling with the topic.

I guess there’s a question of whether we’re going to use the Bible on this subject or not. If so, this guy should not be leading a church. He’s not qualified.

But this doesn’t mean he can’t be in ministry, or be an itinerant speaker. Certainly his experience can be informative and his restoration can be inspiring. But I don’t see any argument that would allow him to be a pastor or elder.

I forgot to ask this in my earlier comment…but when the bible speaks to sexual sin as “worse” does it do so in the terms that God hates it more than other sin or is it worse because it’s more harmful to us?

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I don’t post here ever, but have thought about this a lot. Actually, his “Featured Speaker” status on the National Youth Worker Convention this year has me deciding to probably not attend.

Forgiveness is great and valid and I have no problem with that.

What does feel ‘yucky’ to me is the amount of money and fame he’s making because of his story. I would rejoice at Mr. Haggard healing his marriage, being active in a church, and maybe even having leadership roles if it was all under the radar.

The fact he is putting his face out there so frequently (including documentary film crews following his every move to sell in the future), doing high profile speaking engagements, publicly announcing his new church, and generally thrusting himself back into the forefront just feels wrong.

And gross.

1. Quite simply, yes…it’s hypocritical. Forgiveness never says what someone did is okay. It releases that back to God. He’s big enough to deal with it. It rarely hurts the person that we don’t forgive. It binds us in chains when we hold on and don’t forgive.

2. I’m not sure I have a definitive answer on this one. I can understand how he can be viewed as unqualified by Biblical standards, and I can understand the potential story of restoration he can tell through his life. Does it have to be pastoring a church? I don’t think so. We need to pray for him and his family. I do know that.

I’m glad you approach these topics here, Tyler. You hit all of the topics I’ve vowed to not blog about, so this is a good place to be.

1. It’s not my place to forgive Ted because he didn’t sin against me. I’m not going to hold past transgressions against him (because they are covered completely by the shed blood of Jesus), but I have nothing to forgive him for. He hasn’t harmed me in any way.

2. Ted can still serve Jesus, others, and the kingdom, there is no question about that.

However, entrusting him as the shepherd of a congregation may be asking for trouble. This is a situation where a man who was spiritually leading a congregation deliberately lied and broke the trust of that congregation. He put on a public face that was required of his position/leadership (as pastor and head of the National Association of Evangelicals), but that face was a mask covering some deep issues. Now, everyone has issues yes, but when leading a community spiritually if those issues break trust between you and God and the people God has placed in your care… that is something serious.

I’m worried that Ted may find himself back in the same position he was in before: Publicly portraying one pastoral face while living in shame, brokenness and secrecy. Ultimately, it’s between God, him, and his family (and congregation)… I just don’t think I can applaud him stepping back into a position that *may* lead him back to where he was. My reservations are heightened by the fact that: 1)this is not the same congregation he did harm. This is a brand new group of people. I have to ask, where is the restoration and reconciliation between Ted and those he did sin against? Church hopping is a great way to run from dealing with real issues in one’s life. It’s dangerous when the pastor hops around, starting church after church because that’s all he knows how to do. (not suggesting Ted has done this, but it is a place I don’t want to see him go) 2) Ted recently lied about his intentions to start a church. He publicly said, “nope, not starting one”, then like a week later filed the paper work for his new Church. What I see is a public lie, which is way too close to the situation he was in before.

I believe God does restore people (including pastors). I just don’t think that our assumption of health and feeling like “I can do this again” is necessary God’s sign that it’s time.

That all said, I pray that Ted and his new congregation may know health and that God may be glorified as he continues to work.

What’s interesting to me is how Christians are so quick to say we should forgive Tiger Woods for his many sins and yet Ted doesn’t seem to get the same treatment?

It would be interesting to go back and read your previous post on forgiving Tiger…I think I will do that now.

I don’t know that the two are mutually exclusive as much as you are saying here, but I understand it closer to the more harmful to us.

So far everyone has said that we should forgive Ted. Not sure what you are getting at. My main point above was that forgiveness and restoration, while being closely related, are not the same thing.

Yeah, that’s what I was thinking.

I don’t know that I deserve too much credit. Essentially I didn’t share my opinion and I let all of you instead

No question we are called to forgive Ted. Done deal.

Restoration is very important and a part of repentance. BUT it’s mis-applied in evangelical churches. Restoration as part of repentance is restoration to God, NOT restoration to leadership. The church should lovingly welcome Ted with open arms and help him get restored to God first and his family second. Ted should humbly serve and love the church, but as far as pastoring a flock?

Well I think Ted has disqualified himself from serving as a pastor/elder, per requirements in Timothy and Titus. Not to mention his disregard for the “restoration” process he was put under. It’s clear he had his own intentions on how he would resume his ministry, and to me that’s a clear sign of where he is.

The answer to your first question is yes, but the answer to the 2nd question is more complicated. In a do unto others scenario, I think the answer becomes a bit easier to tease out.

Hypothetically speaking, if I, as a Christian writer, had some kind of affair or sexual sin issues, then such matters would be indicative of serious problems with deception and my own captivity to sin. I would not expect people to take my writing quite as seriously after that. Perhaps writers have some different options, but for someone in the role of a pastor, I think the road back to such a position of trust should be more of a lengthy process and perhaps not even an option.

If I wrote about living free from sin while living smack dab in the middle of it, then my credibility would take a huge shot, and it’s hard to say when I would ever be considered trustworthy again. I think the same goes for Haggard.

Having said all of that, we also need to ask whether the kinds of pastoral positions a guy like him aspires to should be dramatically changed in the first place. That may be the larger issue here.

According ton reporting in Christianity Today Haggard rejected the council that was set up to restore him less than a year after he left the pastorate. He started asking for money from people in direct violation of that council’s direction and instead of submitting he stopped meeting with them.

I think Paul is a good example here. He was in training for 17 years after he became a Christian and even so he spent several years working under Barnabas before going off on his own. and even when he was the lead he almost always had other Christians as partners.

1- forgiveness is about really about me & God, not the other person. even if ted had never repented in any way whatsoever, i am still responsible for forgiveness i choose to give or not give him. there are people who have wronged me in my life who will never make an apology. should i not still release them to the hands of God? ted is a man, and men fall. religion in the hands of man is corrupt. but God is flawless and perfect and receives us no matter what state we are in, cleanses us and returns us. should we not do the same for others?

2- i think you know my answer here. God has restored many fallen people to do great things. moses, david, solomon, samson, peter, paul, and i even believe judas would have as well, had he not chosen to take his own life. if ted is in a place where he can minister to others, then i commend him. and if not, consequences will follow. but i never wish disaster on anyone, so i pray for his success.

i believe that a sin is a sin is a sin. now, the consequences reaped may be greater for some than others. but the initial wrong-doing is no worse, in an of itself than anything else. i believe deeply that’s how God sees it. and really, think about it: jim baker’s sins got him into legal trouble, whereas ted was simply outcasted by christians. the reaping varies. the sowing, not necessarily.

yes forgive or its hypocracy but knowing that anyone can say anything

restoration-look at their “fruits” and what they do Matthew 7:15-20 (New International Version)

The problem with “forgiving” today is that the word doesn’t mean anything to most people.

I find that when I ask another person for forgiveness, I don’t get it. If I say “I’m sorry”. and nothing else, a person will pause and then not try to change me.

This is the new way to ask for forgiveness. Being willing to take whatever the other is going to do to you.

Just my two cents, I need to give more change.

Good post Ash as usual